The Entrepreneur Marriage Problem Nobody Wants to Admit

Megan Yelaney:

Welcome back to business. Not as usual. We have extra, extra, extra special guests. I feel like I always say special guests because every guest is special, but these are extra, extra special guests because we have Angela and James Mitchell on, who are my husband Mike, and my longtime relationship coaches since, gosh, 2022. I think it was maybe even earlier that we started working together. Totally helped save our marriage. Literally the reason we have our twin boys were the first people we told when we pregnant in person. Like, there’s just so many things, so many things about these two that I am beyond excited to have them on the podcast. But the main reason they’re here is they are true experts in helping entrepreneur couples, or at least one of the people in the couple, in the relationship, in the marriage is in. Is an entrepreneur. Because it is just a different beast of a life and helping them really stay happily married and have an incredibly thriving marriage and intimacy and be able to grow their business together and see, still prioritize that. And so that’s exactly what Mike and I go to them for and still.

Megan Yelaney:

Go to them for.

Megan Yelaney:

And so I’m just honored to have them on. Hi, guys. How are you? I’m so happy you’re here. So happy to be here.

James Mitchell:

Great to be here. I love seeing you. I love spending time with you and all the different ways we get to do it.

Megan Yelaney:

I know, I know. I was really pumped when I looked at my calendar. I’m like, yes, I get to talk to Angela and James today. So let’s start. Even though I’ve definitely talked about you guys many times over the years on podcasts and email, so some of my audience is probably very familiar and very excited, but some might be newer to you. So I would love you guys to just share a little bit about your journey, how you got to what you do now. How did you get to being relationship coaches specifically for entrepreneurs?

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. So I have been a counselor therapist for 20 something years now, which I always joke. I’m 28, so, you know, I just started really young.

Megan Yelaney:

Wow. Started so young.

Angela Mitchell:

I look great.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

Anyway, so, yeah, I’ve been doing that work. James was an entrepreneur, has been a lifelong entrepreneur. Since you were what, like, 12?

James Mitchell:

You were 12 was my first. My first gig.

Megan Yelaney:

Wait, what did you do at 12? I don’t think I knew that.

James Mitchell:

I painted curbs. I painted the addresses on curbs. So I drive around my little. We lived in a golf course community. I drive around the golf course community in my golf cart, go knock on doors and ask people if they wanted me to paint their numbers on curbs for.

Megan Yelaney:

Wait. I love that. That’s so smart.

Angela Mitchell:

I love that little at 12.

Megan Yelaney:

That’s great. I love it.

James Mitchell:

Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

So I had the, I don’t know, audacity to marry an entrepreneur.

James Mitchell:

I’m not courageous.

Angela Mitchell:

Right.

Megan Yelaney:

Courage. Courage. Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

And I’ll just. Honestly, a lot of his entrepreneurial skills were what attracted me to him. Right. He was a picture thinker and creative and problem solver and go getter and all the things. Right. And so I came into entrepreneurship because first we started with him being the entrepreneur, and I had like the W2 job. I was working for other people as a therapist. I was at nonprofits early in my career, and then I went to work for a school system. And then we. We learned how to navigate that because it wasn’t always easy. Right. Especially in the early years when income was, you know, maybe inconsistent or, you know, we had babies and you know how that is. And you’re trying to, like, focus on the babies and the building a business, and it’s just taking so much energy and so busy and through some of that got disconnected. Not terribly. Like, I think we both knew we would survive it, but we weren’t willing just to survive. We wanted to do more than survive. And so we really found these tools for ourselves, started using them later on. James. Well, I’ll let you talk how you went into coaching.

James Mitchell:

Well, I believe in a recipe. If somebody’s got a system and a process I can follow, then I’m going to follow it and I’m going to model that, and it’s going to help me get where I want to go faster and with more ease and with more success. And so one of the things that we’ve always done in our relationship is be intentional. And so we started creating a recipe based on her counseling knowledge and my entrepreneurial background to make sure that we were focused on our strategy of life, the vision we were headed to. And then she was bringing in the let’s make sure we stay connected. My first career as we were married was in real estate. So I was hustling real estate, and that’s how we built our first tier of wealth. And I’ll always remember the day that Angela looked at me and said, I’ve never known you to be happy in your career. And I was like, I thought this.

Angela Mitchell:

Was, like, common knowledge. I was just stating the obvious.

Megan Yelaney:

And he was like, what are you talking about?

James Mitchell:

You know, I love. I love real estate. And then I started to realize that I love parts of it and the interesting thing was we would go away once a year on what we call our marriage retreat, something that we created for ourselves. And I would always come back on fire. And that’s all I wanted to talk about. And that was just where my heart was. And when she pointed out that I wasn’t fully fulfilled, I was like, okay, well, I think this love intentionally thing has some legs. We’ve been helping friends out. They’ve been asking us what we were doing. And that started the shift for us into saying, how can we share this recipe with the world to bring more love to it? And really started to step into a leadership role in our community as the leaders in love and the leaders in bringing more heart to the marriage. And then ultimately, you know, what that does for our community is it creates more time, effort, and energy that we can spend creating outside of our marriage, as opposed to always. We did spend a lot of time on the repair structures. Right. Like, oh, you know, this wasn’t solid, everything else. So we decided to go all in on this. This thing called love intentionally.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. And James started with coaching entrepreneurs. He was coaching realtors and business leaders.

James Mitchell:

I wanted to feel like an expert in what I was doing. I felt like an expert in the old jobs, and I was like, well, hey, if I’m going to step in this world. So I went with what I knew. I got a couple thousand hours coaching realtors. That was the job. Coaching entrepreneurs and helping them get going. Um, and also we started getting mentors in the sex and intimacy space, as well as other aspects that we could really leverage into making sure that we had a holistic approach to helping the marriage thrive.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah. Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

So it kind of developed from taking his count, my counseling skills, his entrepreneur skills, his coaching skills. He’s also been a men’s coach, still is a men’s coach. And then basically in our own lived experience and saying, let’s combine all these things into something the world really needs, which we found was that people don’t people. A lot of people work with couples. Right. That’s common. There’s a lot of couples counselors, a lot of couples coaches out there, and then there’s business coaches. But rarely, we found, are people combining the two and saying, how do we like, it’s like you said, it’s its own beast, kind of being an entrepreneur and trying to build that in the strain that I can put on a marriage, the beauty that that can add to a marriage. But let’s. Let’s. Let’s do something specifically for the entrepreneurs, because it is a little different.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah. Oh, my gosh. A hundred percent. And it’s. Even though I, like, know your story, it’s interesting and really cool to hear you guys kind of say it back in that way, because I’m like, wow, this is why you’re so good at what you do, because you have both lived and breathed being an entrepreneur. And I think, too, for those who are listening, who maybe you’re the entrepreneur, you’re probably listening because you are and your partner’s not. That’s exactly what Angela lived. So you got to experience, like, the highs and the lows and. And along with the highs and lows of income is highs and lows of, like, our mood. Sometimes, even though we try to regulate, it’s hard. So, you know, all that comes with that. And that so can affect how you respond and show up for your partner, and that really can affect the relationship. And I know a lot of people listening because I’ve coached so many people who have literally said this, have had their partner start to really resent their business, and it’s. It’s created so much tension in their marriage and in their intimacy because they’re, like, fighting over the business because the business maybe hasn’t taken off to where they want it to yet, and they feel like they’re spending more time on it than with the family. And so many aspects of that. So you guys have just lived and breathed it. So everything that you’re sharing and when you guys go and follow James and Angela and check out their podcast and their book and all the. All the fun things, you’re going to really see that seep through every crack of what you guys do. It’s just like, you have lived and breathed this experience. It’s your story, which is why you’re so great at doing this. Not only do you have the credentials, but you have the lived experience, which to me is even more important. So, all that being said, there’s so many avenues we can go down, but one thing I would love to just first talk about is actually, like, something that Mike and I noticed when we first started working with you guys is when we started working with you. It was when you were sex and intimacy coaches specifically. And when we started working with you, I was kind of under the assumption, honestly, when I heard sex and intimacy, I was like, they’re just going to start assigning us to have sex, like, in a certain way. I didn’t know what to expect, really. And it was so interesting that, like, that wasn’t part of it for a Bit it was like we had to do some real connection, foundational, like you were saying, some vision, vision setting and all that jazz. So if you guys could just like walk through a little bit of your process. When entrepreneurs come and they’re like, we’re feeling disconnected. We’re feeling like because of the business and because of prioritizing everything else. Like, what is actually the first step that most people miss, that they think they just have to jump right to like sex and scheduling that, like, what is the first thing you do with people to like bring it back home? Yeah.

James Mitchell:

I was gonna say, thanks to you, we have a framework with a really cool name.

Megan Yelaney:

I love it.

James Mitchell:

And it’s called codes. C, O, D, E, S. And what a lot of people miss is they jump straight to the action of it. And where we start is with the C, which is we want to create a container for the work that we’re going to do. A safe container that says this is what we’re here to work on. And the other aspect of that C is connect. There’s a phrase in the coaching world with relationships, we want to connect before we correct. And so when we can start working on connection, then we can really work into how that layers into the intimacy or the lack of intimacy or where we’re missing each other. And when we get into that connection phase, then we get to start at the base foundational level, wherever that person is. And so if it’s he’s not taking the trash out or she is extremely disengaged or has a complete lack of presence when she’s home, she’s always on her phone. Right. All those things that are standing in the way of connection. When we can start there, then we can really move. We go slow to go fast.

Angela Mitchell:

Like the sex and intimacy, it’s like the tip of the iceberg. Right. I always like, picture the Titanic. I don’t know. Thanks, Leonardo DiCaprio and Kate Winslet. But you know, it’s like, it’s like that’s what you see. Yeah. Or that’s what sometimes couples come saying. The problem is that we have these mismatched libidos. Right. We’re not having sex or he wants it more than she does or vice versa. And that sex and intimacy is so interesting because there’s so much underneath it that all has to be going, right?

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

For that piece to work, Right?

Megan Yelaney:

Yes.

Angela Mitchell:

There needs to be safety, there needs to be trust. And you know, even more so in a long term relationship.

Megan Yelaney:

Right.

Angela Mitchell:

Like I get people have one night stands back, you know, maybe now when they’re older, but when they were younger. Right. Like, but as people are in long term committed relationships, it just shifts. We shift our desire shifts from more of that spontaneous desire, that butterfly. Oh, they just gave me a look and now I want to jump their bones to a responsive desire. And responsive desire, which is normal as we age and as our relationships mature and are longer, it requires more to be, like, in place to actually allow that desire to arise. Right. So that’s why we start with all these other things. What, you know, how is the connection as, which we define as? Are you feeling seen, appreciated and desired? We say those are the three pillars of connection. So do I feel like my partner really sees me? Do they get me? Do they understand me? Right? Are they present when they’re with me? Do I feel appreciated? Are we appreciative of each other’s strengths and roles rather than just nagging each other and criticizing each other and annoyed by each other? Right? And then is there desire? Is there? And that’s usually the third one. Right. We have to have those other two in place and then we can get to the desire, which can involve, you know, are we being playful with each other? Are we flirting? Are we filling all of our intimacy buckets? Not just sex. Is there emotional intimacy? Is there intellectual intimacy, spiritual, whatever might be important to you?

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah. Oh, all of that is. I just remember when we, you know, when, when we started going, oh, wow, all those things you just laid out, that’s. That’s not what I thought we’d start with in the best way. I was like, oh, I see it. Like, you painted a very clear picture of what, what it takes. And so that by the time that did come, it was like, much easier to get into that. And two, it’s just we both, like you said we were, I think when we started working with you guys at six years into marriage after coming from a separation, you know, so we were totally different. We’re just different people by that time. And so it was such a different desire. And we felt like almost, and I know a lot of people listening, they might not admit it publicly, but they’re definitely going to feel this. I was almost, like, nervous. I was like, I feel like I don’t even know him in this way anymore because it’s so different from when we were first dating, you know, and then add kids to the mix and it’s like we’re starting that over again. And that’s why, you know, we’re working with you guys again. So it’s just A very. It’s interesting. It, like, it does evolve. And I think because you have such a solid process that does work, it’s really a nice North Star for people to go back to when they have these, like. Because it’s not going to be just free flowing. Oh, you’re good, you’re connected forever now. It’s like you’re going to have your, your conflicts and all that and you help everyone, you know with that, with the conflict resolution and all that jazz. There’s one thing that, like, well, there’s so many. There’s more than one thing, but there’s so many times when I’m talking to entrepreneur couples and I know you guys, as the experts in this field will probably attest to this. I think one of the biggest things that entrepreneur couples struggle with is prioritization. And we’re like, oh, it’s just a season, it’s just a season. It’s just a busy season. I’ve literally said that. Mike has literally said that. Where we keep pushing off the things that we say we’re going to do to connect, even though we know what to do because we’re in a lunch or the kids are in a really crazy time in life or people are sick or whatever it is. And I know this is a little bit of a broad question, but how do you help people or what are some of the things they can start doing to like, stop just talking about it and start actually doing it when everything else seems to be prioritized besides their relationship?

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah, great question. I think we’re. I’m gonna speak for everyone here. I think we’re all guilty of that. Of that. Just that, oh, it’s a busy season. And, and that can be true sometimes there are just busy seasons. If you have two sick toddlers, like, you might not be on your game with like sex and intimacy that week. Right. And that’s fair. The problem is that those seasons can very easily slip into just states of being. Right? And I think that’s where you. And it takes a lot of intention to avoid that slide from a season into just like a state of being. This is how we operate. And so one of the big things we do is for prioritizing is scheduling. Right. Like entrepreneurs, we tend to be busy, right? We have appointments or even some of us that are good with our time will time block when we’re going to work on our content, when we’re going to record our podcast, whatever it might be, when’s client work. But we found that if something doesn’t get scheduled. If it doesn’t get space in the calendar, it often doesn’t happen because there’s always things barking at us and waving its hand in our face saying, oh, I need your attention. I need your attention. And so if we are not intentionally carving out the time, not waiting for the time to just magically appear as blank space in our calendar, it never does. Never does. We have to intentionally carve it out. So there’s an analogy maybe a lot of your listeners have heard, but the idea of the. The rocks and then the pebbles and then the sand. Have you heard of this one?

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

So, like, if you’re trying to fill a glass, you know, if you have a glass container and you’re filling it, if you put in, you know, the sand and the pebbles, the little stuff first, and then you try to put in the big rocks, it doesn’t all fit. Right. But if you start with the big rocks, which in this case are the things that are most important, and then you let the pebbles go in and fill in around it, and then the sand to fill in the small spaces, it all fits. Right. So we view our schedule as the same way. So we have our weekly meeting, which we swear by. I know you and Mike do it religiously as well. And most of our couples, we assign it as homework for couples that we work with. And they all, even the ones that are like, oh, I don’t want another meeting, end up loving it and seeing the way it really helps.

Megan Yelaney:

It’s wild how disconnected we feel when we don’t do it. Yeah. Which is rare. And I’m like, oh, my gosh, this is why we have to do this.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. And so part of that meeting is scheduling what we say is important to us. What we say we value. We’re going to walk the. You know, walk the walk. So if we say that it’s important to us to have time for our relationship and connect, we schedule for us. We schedule one night a week for intimacy. Doesn’t have to be sex, but it can. But intimacy where. And usually ours is after we put the kids to bed and we just. No tv, no screens, no Netflix. Right. We just focus on each other in some form of intimacy. We schedule things like exercise because we say our health is important to us. We schedule family time outdoors because that is important to us. So we schedule all the things that help us as a couple and us as a family stay connected. And we put. Make sure those big rocks are in the calendar first, because other stuff’s going to get done. We’re going to check our email. That’s going to get done.

James Mitchell:

Laundry is always going to happen, right?

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah.

James Mitchell:

And one of the. We do a relationship review. We’ll do that for free with any couple that wants to come in and just do a little vibe check and see what’s happening. And we’ll do a calendar check, and if you show us your calendar, then we can tell you what your values are.

Megan Yelaney:

Ooh. Oh, that’s probably so, like, disarming for some people, right? Like, look at your calendar and are you actually, you know, doing what you say your values are? That’s huge.

Angela Mitchell:

Oh.

Megan Yelaney:

Even I’m like, oh, I gotta go look at my calendar. But that’s. That’s so big, like you say. I mean, and that’s where, you know, I’ll say, spending time with my boys is so important. If every single second of my day was working, then, you know, am I living up to that value? You know? You know, for. Of sure, of course, within reason of what you can do and work and all that jazz. But still, it’s. I think you hit on something, too, because the year that Mike and I really struggled and just felt like we were kind of roommates and becoming just like ships passing in the night was it. We felt so successful in work. And I know a lot of people listening have felt that where they’re like, I know what to do for my content. I know what to do for my launches. I know what to do with my clients. I feel really solid in business. Like, business feels good, and this part doesn’t. So I’m just gonna, like, keep diving into what feels good because that makes me feel worthy. That was 100% our. Our thing. And so I always like to share with people, like, our business isn’t why we separated. It’s not what caused. Just made us go, wow, we had these issues we didn’t deal with. Now these things make us feel good. Let’s just keep diving into those. Let’s add more calls, let’s add more stuff. Let’s make, you know, less time for each other. And so it kind of just like, was this snowball, until all of a sudden, you’re like, wow, my whole calendar. Obviously, my main value is making money and. And just work. And that really, truly wasn’t. But it was what I was living, like you were saying. So I think that’s so huge. And I think everyone just, like, taking a look at their calendar is really great. And taking guys up on that. We’ll definitely link wherever they can get that, like, free Review one thing, too that comes. Comes to mind. Like, within. Within the meetings. Do you give or suggest any. Like, I don’t know if they’re, like, rules or boundaries in terms of when life does happen, how to. What if life keeps happening and you keep bouncing things or changing things? Do you have, like, a reset or any, like, kind of roadblocks for people? Does that make sense?

Angela Mitchell:

So, like, if. In regards to the meeting.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah. Like, if you’re sending that intimacy for the week, and for some reason something comes up and you can’t do it, so you reschedule it, but that keeps happening. Like, is there any, like, way or, like, I don’t know if guardrails is the right word, but exercise mantra. Something that you would tell your couple, like, okay, I got to ask you this hard question right now kind of thing. And it might be just that. Yeah.

James Mitchell:

The first thing that comes to mind is there would be a lack of leadership anywhere in the relationship if that continues to happen. It just. Angela has this thing, she says, and it’s beautiful where actually you say it. The pattern thing.

Angela Mitchell:

I was like, which beautiful thing do I say? So many.

Megan Yelaney:

I say so many.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. I say that it takes two to create a pattern, and it only takes one to break it.

James Mitchell:

And that one is the person who is deciding in that moment to step up as the leader. Hey, this is continuing to happen. I’m going to go ahead, and I’m not gonna put my foot down, but this is what I’m gonna stand for. I’m gonna stand for this, and I’m gonna choose to be the leader in this moment and the leader in our relationship to make sure this thing starts to happen. And we just need one person to really step up into that role. And then we can see a lot shift really quickly.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

Cause we look at patterns. I think about them as dances. We talk about this in the book Patterns. I do a dance move, and then James responds with, he moves.

Megan Yelaney:

Right.

Angela Mitchell:

And so we’re, like, moving together to not step on each other’s feet. Right. And that’s how patterns kind of are created. And then if one of you does a different move, it changes the dance. Right. So we try to teach both people in the couple ways to interrupt the pattern. Right. Or do the dance differently. And then we’re hoping in any given moment, at least one of you has the capacity to actually do something different. Right. So if you both have that. And so to James point, one person really taking leadership of, like, the meeting and making the change. Like, yes, we need to hold this sacred. I would also say as far as, like, scheduling intimacy, consent is always, always non negotiable. Right. And so what we’ve done is, let’s say life has happened and there’s been something big or I’m exhausted or somebody’s sick or whatever our intimacy might look like sitting on opposite ends of the couch, rubbing each other’s feet.

Megan Yelaney:

Right.

Angela Mitchell:

It doesn’t have to. Like, we can switch what type of intimacy we are having and like, what do we need in this moment? What might help us actually feel more regulated, feel more connected that then can help us deal with whatever life is throwing at us. And that is great too. The point is really just to take the time, even if it’s small. I would say presence trumps quantity of time. Right. So if we can have 15 minutes of really good connection, we’re both present with each other and giving each other some love. That’s better than two hours of, like, half present, you know, distract Netflix in.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah. Yeah.

James Mitchell:

I think one more important thing to say here is that when. When this is happening and if I’m setting up where we’re scheduling the intimacy and it’s not happening because let’s just. I’m going to pick on Angela for a second. Like, let’s say she’s tired or like whatever the season is in her cycle is just not really the right one for that. Like, I get it intellectually, but emotionally it can hurt. Right. I get disappointed. I can feel disappointment, I can feel resentment. I can start to, you know, tell myself these stories that I’m the one that’s trying and she’s not meeting me. And so really, to step into a leadership role, it becomes necessary for us to become very able to handle what’s coming up inside of our own bodies, those emotions that are coming up. So it’s not just like, oh, let me protect myself. I’m gonna stop scheduling this so I don’t have to experience disappointment again next Wednesday night when it’s not gonna happen. So that’s a huge piece of what we get to do is go to the next layer and go to the next layer and just go deeper and deeper until we can really understand what emotion is getting in the way of us actually able. Being able to do those really important intimacy values that we. We put as big rocks.

Megan Yelaney:

Yes. What you just said was literally something I’ve experienced the last few months. And I’m like, why am I going to schedule this? But then it’s funny, I wrote down something to ask you guys and talk About. I was talking about this with a friend, and she kind of reminded me of this. I’m like, oh, Angela and James taught me this. Taught me and Mike this so much, so many times. And I just kind of, like, not slipped my mind, but it was nice for it to be reiterated is I was just saying, you know, we felt a little disconnected, and the boy is just taking all of our priority and energy and all that jazz and just. Just life. Life and Right. And I said I was a little disappointed that I wasn’t feeling like I was being shown the love that I, you know, you guys help. Help us go through our love me lists, and we share, you know, how. How we like to fill up. And I felt like I wasn’t getting that, and I felt like I was giving that decently, sort of. And then I stopped doing it because I was annoyed that I wasn’t getting it. So I was like, I’m done, you know, And I found myself really treating it like a game that I was winning. And I was like, oh, check. I did it. I did it, I did it. And when I was talking to her, almost verbatim said, what you guys have said to me, the more you show them and the give them the love that. That, you know, that they want to receive without expectation and just give it, give it, give it from a true place of, like, I want them to feel loved, they’re going to notice, and it’s going to come back to you. And I realized even when I was giving that love, I was, like, giving it to get it, if that makes sense. And so I’d love you guys to expand upon that, because I think it’s so hard in the moment, especially maybe it’s an entrepreneur trait, I don’t know. But to be like, I feel like I’m giving, and it’s just not equal, and that’s frustrating. So, yeah, I just like your take on that.

James Mitchell:

The first thing I would say is, love is expansive. There’s no finite amount. And the more you give, the more that you get. And then it comes back to that connection piece. Am I feeling seen? Am I feeling appreciated? Am I feeling desired? And what it feels like is underneath what you’re talking about is, I’m doing this thing, but he doesn’t see me for it. He’s not even appreciating for the fact that I’m doing this and I’m providing him the love that he said that he wanted. And so then there’s no desire. And so it always can come back to one of those three things. And I think just reminding ourselves that love is expansive, and I want more of that in order to receive more than I want to create more. And it starts this different momentum of growth. Right?

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. I think also a couple things I’m like, which direction do I go? There’s a few.

Megan Yelaney:

I know it’s a broad one for.

Angela Mitchell:

Me personally, and I think James is the same, although his is on a different topic. I. When I start keeping score, that’s when that’s my red flag that, oh, we’re a little disconnected because I’m starting to keep score when we’re connected. When we’re connected, I’m not keeping score. Right. And so that is often my little red flag going off. And what historically I have done is felt resentment, right? Like I’m doing all this stuff, Whether it’s household labor, I’m doing more than he is, or, you know, the things I’m keeping score on. For him, it was often around intimate intimacy. Like, he. You know, for him, it’s like I’m initiating more than she is, or I’m really having to lead this in our relationship. And so when we start keeping score, that’s our first sign. Okay? And then for me, I remember when I learned, and this was years ago, maybe decades ago now, that resentment is a sign that I have not held or set or held a boundary or maybe asked for what I want and need. And so there is a piece of it where, yes, I want to give the love to him because it’s just coming from that place of I want to love him, and then it is more likely to be in return. I also want to make sure that I am speaking up when I need to. So for me, when I learned that, it was empowering because before, I kind of felt like the victim. Like, I can’t make him do anything. So if I’m not getting what I want, I’m just like, the victim in this situation. And when I started looking at it more on what can I do? It was much more empowering. I’m like, oh, I don’t have to just sit over here and feel like the victim and feel resentful, right? I can actually do something about it. So some of that doing is, how am I showing up for him? Am I giving without expectation right when he is. Am I just noticing the times that I’m not getting what I want? Am I really noticing the times that I am? Because sometimes we get, you know, our different lenses on, and when we’re focused on what we’re not getting. We tend to see that more than what we do. So when I. When he is doing something that makes me feel loved or even just a little thing, he makes my coffee in the morning. And I know that’s an act of service he does for me to make sure I’m appreciating it. Because if I’m telling him thank you and appreciating it, and even, like, I can go a little overboard, like, wow, Like, I really. I really did appreciate that. Like, it made me feel loved. It made me feel taken care of. Thank you. Right. Rather than just the quick thank you for the cup of coffee, then he also has more of a desire to keep doing those things because he’s being acknowledged and appreciated for him. So I start looking at what do I have the power to do, what’s in my control. That can help. Maybe again, when we go back to that dance, that can help shift the dance. Yeah.

Megan Yelaney:

Oh, I love that. And I think, like you said, especially for entrepreneurs who like a list, like a do this, do that, that’s, like, very tactical, too. You know, it’s like, hey, this is. This is what you can and can’t control, right? Yeah, it just came up recently. I was like, oh, I want to talk to them about that because I know that it’s so hard for us to do in the moment. And I love that you said about the keeping score. That’s such a red flag.

Angela Mitchell:

That’s.

Megan Yelaney:

That’s such a good, like, mic drop moment. I was like, yes, that’s so true. One thing I wanted to ask you too, because a lot of people who are listening, who are entrepreneurs and have kids or want kids, and so they’re prepping for that, and they’re probably nervous. They’re nervous that they’ve heard stories and seen. Seen a lot of people who have kids, and then unfortunately, their marriage really, really suffers when it’s supposed, you know, supposed to be this beautiful creation you made together.

Angela Mitchell:

And.

Megan Yelaney:

And it can be really, really taxing on a marriage. And, you know, Mike and I have definitely experienced our fair share of that. We have such a solid foundation from the work we did with you guys. So we’re, like, all in. We’re good. And we know we’ll get back there, especially with your help. But for people who are listening, there’s this, like, there’s. I don’t know if I’m not going to say the quote exactly right, but it’s kind of just more of a concept. And I know we’ve talked about it of at Certain point, your marriage has to be number one, even prioritized over your children. And some people hearing that are going to be like, what? That’s crazy. They should be your number one, right? And I remember, like, Mike’s dad, actually, before he passed, this was like, a couple years before he passed, he said, when you guys have kids, please promise me you will always put each other first. And that was speaking from someone who did get divorced.

Angela Mitchell:

Right.

Megan Yelaney:

And he was in his second marriage, and I remember that always stuck with us. And we were just like, wow. He was so adamant about it. He constantly talked about that, like, that’s the biggest thing he wanted to leave. Like, one of the biggest things he wanted to leave us with. And. And now I’m like, I get it. I understand now. So for people who are listening and hear that and feel very like, oh, that’s jarring. Like, your kids are supposed to be first. Can you explain your thought process behind that? Because I know you guys, you know, swear by that, too.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah, I feel pretty strongly on this one. And I know it can be a controversial thing. And not to say we have three kids, I love them dearly. Right. I would take a bullet for any of them, like, multiple times. Right. Like, so it’s not about love. It’s not about what it’s about. And I was. I worked with kids for many years as a counselor. And so I would say, both from my personal and professional experience, I think the best gift we can give our children is healthy and happy parents in a healthy and happy relationship, hands down. Right? What divorce and separation. And I know sometimes it happens, right? And I’m not. This isn’t to shame anyone for it happening. Sometimes there are relationships that aren’t healthy and aren’t going to be healthy and, you know, abusive or whatever. And, yes, those need to end up. But when we can. When we. When we’re with a person willing to work with us on it, right? And we can maintain that our kids are just set up for success. Statistically, they are. Right. You can read any of the statistics on it. And so I do feel like that’s the best gift we can actually give our children. And also, thinking about how we interact with each other is the foundation of our home. It is what sets the tone for our home that our children are living in and growing up in. And what they feel at home is what they will come back to as an adult. So if you think about, what do you want for your children when they find a partner, when they establish their own home, how do you want it to feel. Do you want it to feel tense and people yelling or discon. Silent contempt? Right. Or do you want it to feel loving with respectful communication and someone who appreciates them and holds their hand? Right. And because they will default into what was modeled for them. Now, that’s not to say those of us I. My parents were divorced, James. Parents are still very happily married. So that’s been a nice model, but 47 years. Yeah.

Megan Yelaney:

That’s amazing.

Angela Mitchell:

But that’s not to say that if you come from a home like that, you can’t choose something differently, but it is harder. It takes active work because our default setting is what we grew up with. And so a lot of it for me is that I actually think you’re doing the best thing as a parent by putting your marriage first.

Megan Yelaney:

Oh, I love that, James. I saw your face, like, light up when I said that, because I know you.

James Mitchell:

I love these. These conversations at the end of the day, too. We have worked with a lot of couples that are moving into empty nesting. Their kids are in high school and they’re starting to have their own lives. They’re starting to spread their wings and they’re looking at each other going like, wow, we have put these kids first for so long. How do we get back to us?

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah.

James Mitchell:

How do we establish the love in our relationship that’s going to drive us through the next 30, 40 years? Because at some point, you’re going to just look at each other in the house and it’s just going to be the two of you. And if you’ve put all of your energy into kids, then there’s not a whole lot left in the tank for what we’re going to get to experience in this next, you know, period of life, which can be some of the best.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah.

Megan Yelaney:

Oh, that’s such a good niche, too. Empty nesters. I’m like, wait, that’s like, so needed. I’m sure, you know, it’s the same friend who I was referencing. Her and her husband have been very diligent about their relationship throughout their kids whole life, and they became empty nesters recently. And they are so happy and so excited. They love their kids, but they’re like, yes.

James Mitchell:

Walk around the house naked now. Yeah.

Megan Yelaney:

And they’re so connected. So they’re just. Just like, we’re not lost at all. And I’m like, man, that’s amazing. I want that. I want to make sure you know that. Exactly. And. And also too, something that came up for Mike and I where we were like, okay, we Definitely need to revisit help with James and Angela.

Angela Mitchell:

And it’s just.

Megan Yelaney:

It’s not a, you know, a shame or a, oh, my gosh, we lost track of everything. It’s just life happens. And you. You need that touch point again sometimes.

Angela Mitchell:

Right?

Megan Yelaney:

We have that solid foundation. We’re good, and we still need that help. Is one day I said to him, I feel like I’m the mother of your children and not your wife right now. Like, you’re constantly complimenting how great of a mom I am. You’re constantly complimenting how great of an entrepreneur I am, how great of a, you know, businesswoman I am. But I don’t feel like I’m your wife. I feel like I’m that right now. And that was a big, like, whoa moment for us, you know, and same same for him. He felt the same way. And it was like every compliment, everything was around the kids, and it’s like we existed before them. They’re here because of us, because of our love, you know, like, this sparked everything. And so just coming. I think it’s so much of what you guys do for people is helping them reconnect and come back to who they are at this point in life too. Right. As you evolve as well. And when you’re running businesses, when you have kids, it’s just. It can feel like the lowest thing on the totem pole when it should be the first. And I think the last thing I’ll say to all of this before we, like, dive into your incredible gift, which your gift helps with, is it doesn’t take a ton of time. I think people, like, hear I gotta work on my marriage. And it’s like, oh, it’s gonna be an extra couple hours a week. And it’s like, no, no, no. It doesn’t have to take that much time. And when we look at our calendar, like you were saying, what are you doing at night? Are you watching Netflix? Are you doing this stuff? And that’s all fine and great, but if you can’t replace one of those sessions with this meeting with this intimacy, then that’s a deeper discussion, you know, of values, like you were saying. So, yeah, I just love the work you guys do. It’s so incredible. Share a little bit about your marriage meeting checklist that we’re gonna have everyone go get, because it’s game changed us for sure, and our connection.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. So we love it. I loved it from the start. Jane says, learn to love it.

James Mitchell:

Yeah, I got. I warmed up to it. There’s usually one person in the relationship that’s like, yeah, weekly meeting. The other one’s like, what the hell are you talking about? Like, I don’t want to do that. And so we found a way to help it be something that both partners can get what they want, need, and desire from in an effort to help their marriage become the greatest strategic advantage in their life and growing their business and creating the life of their dreams.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. So a lot of entrepreneurs are used to having, like, a business meeting, whether it’s business meeting with themselves, if you’re a solopreneur or your team. And so we treat them, our marriage, the same way. We have our weekly meeting, so we do ours on Sunday because we also work together. We have our business meeting on Monday, so we keep separate. If you out there, anyone that works with your partner, we keep those separate. We have a marriage meeting and a business meeting. So our marriage meeting, we do on Sundays. We do it every week without fail. If something happens like James was at a men’s retreat a couple weeks ago, then we might need to. We just reschedule. We do it Sunday night instead of Sunday morning, or we do it Monday. So there aren’t cancellations, there’s reschedules. And we start with setting the container like we talked about before. So we start with, you know, getting free of distractions. Maybe we’ll take a couple breaths together just to settle in. And then we share gratitudes and appreciations for each other to kind of set the tone.

James Mitchell:

This one’s important.

Angela Mitchell:

Yes, we have. We have learned the hard way. Like, we, like, kind of get into it. And we’re like, yeah. And then we’re like, oh, wait, we forgot to celebrate. And, like, do. Yes.

Megan Yelaney:

That’s so good. I’ve been. We’ve been not doing that first. So you just reminded me. I’m like, oh, crap, we gotta do that first.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah, yeah, it helps. So we do that. And then the first part is that emotional check in. And so that is a great time. Right. Like what you were talking about before, Megan, on if you’re feeling like, you know, your love tank is a little low, you haven’t been receiving it when you do the check in. Because this is the safe container to do it in, it tends to go better than in the moment when you’re feeling resentment. And so that’s when we have a chance to go. How are you doing? Like, well, you know, I’m feeling. I don’t know, I’m not feeling super connected. I think I could use some more, you know, physical touch. Right could you just hold my hand more this week? Or whatever it might be. Right. But where you get to express how you’re feeling and ask for what you need. Sometimes it’s relationship oriented, and sometimes it’s just in general. Like, I am totally overwhelmed. I’m in the middle of a launch. I’m feeling completely depleted. And then your partner can go, okay, how can I support you?

Megan Yelaney:

You know?

Angela Mitchell:

And maybe it’s as simple as doing the Costco run that week. Right. It can be logistical even. Or maybe it’s just like, I just need you to give me a hug every now and then and tell me I’m doing great. You know, that’s what I literally told.

Megan Yelaney:

Mike that last week. I was like, every day I need you to give me a hug and tell me I’m doing great. Yes, Perfect.

Angela Mitchell:

Perfect.

James Mitchell:

Exactly.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. So that’s a chance to share where we’re at and ask for what we need and ask for how we can support each other that week. And we have found that by doing that weekly, it just nips so many things in the bud. Any, like, small resentments brewing wherever the.

James Mitchell:

Check engine light’s been on or the red or yellow flags are showing up, It’s a place to bring those to the forefront before they build.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. And it’s preventative, too. Like, I. I distinctly remember when James one week said he was overwhelmed, and I’m usually the one that owns that emotion in our household. And so when he said he was overwhelmed, I was like, oh, okay. So I made sure I didn’t ask him for anything extra that week. I did offer to take some things off of his plate that I could. Right. And I think that really prevented disagreements and disconnect from even happening. Yeah, that’s the first important part. And then we dive into the logistics, and that’s where we go over our schedule for the week, our calendars, we meal plan for the week, we make our grocery list. So we only have to do one grocery trip, put our big rocks in.

James Mitchell:

The calendar, Exercise, self care, social life, friend time. I need my guy time. Getting into my men’s containers can really help me also navigate some of the emotions that I’m handling that don’t really belong to be explored or expressed or let’s just say, like, work through. Right. With her. I can go take care of that stuff myself. So we do financial check. Right. How are we doing on the cash? What’s going on?

Angela Mitchell:

And then we look at which we’ve set at our marriage retreat, which I know you all have done Our marriage retreat as well, those yearly goals or annual goals, we will. We don’t take a big look every week, but we just go, is there anything we need to be working on? Like, we talked at our marriage retreat about how we’re going to be going to Europe in June, and we have plane tickets booked, but not hotels. I’d like to book the hotels this week. You know, that kind of thing, like, whatever. Are there any big goals that need to be chipped away at this week? So, yeah, that’s our format. It takes us about an hour. I think when you start, it could take a little longer than that because you have, like, maybe a backlog. There might be a backlog of resentments or, like, things not really in order that it gets easier. And so for us, we do it in an hour, sometimes less.

James Mitchell:

One of our recent clients, he was. She was like, yeah, meeting. I’ve been wanting to do this. And he’s like, so there’s a section for grievances, huh? And I was like, yeah, man. It’s not like Festivus. We’re not just going to do, like, grievances. Ar. Grievances once. Once a year. And he was really, like, flat out nervous about that. Right. And, you know, I’m going to say that’s fair to a certain degree. But what really got his attention and got him on board was the idea that once we clear the backlog, now we’re connected, and now every single one gets to go a little bit smoother and smoother. And also, what will the. You know, one of the coaching tips we like in that space is that if there really is something we need to. Need extra time to dive into, we’ll just take that note in our meeting. Great. And then we’ll schedule a specific time to dive into that and go as deep as we need to go.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. If we got some financial stuff coming up, we’re like, okay, we should probably schedule a separate finance meeting. Now, for us, those are rare, but we can do it, right? Like, if we need a deeper dive into any of the topics that makes sense.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I love this. It’s so. It’s so practical and it’s so simple. Yet, like, when you actually start implementing it, you’re like, whoa, this makes such a difference. And again, connection. And I know for Mike, his love language is quality time. And even after, I’m usually the one who, like, schedules the meetings and, you know, has a stick to it. But afterwards, he’s like, wow, I feel so much more connected now. Like, after spending that real quality time, you know, which is interesting. And something that came up when you were saying, like, you know, ask for I’m overwhelmed this week, or this is my capacity. Something I. I think I really learned this from you guys too, is just like, everyone has a different capacity. And I’m not saying that this is a blanket statement, so don’t take offense, James, or men listening. But from what. At least the women I’ve worked with and myself, I tend to find we have a bigger capacity. Like, I can mom all day, entrepreneur all day, do stuff around the house. Now. Am I tired?

Angela Mitchell:

Sure.

Megan Yelaney:

Do I need to recharge? Yes. But I tend to find I can hold more. And that’s just kind of always how it’s been with us. And once I kind of, like, learned that that’s just. Just our capacities, I stopped getting, like, as annoyed if I felt like I’m doing more and you should be doing this, and. And it did start to feel more even. Even though maybe if you looked at the calendar and things like that, it wasn’t as. Does that make sense? Like, I feel like that probably comes up a lot for entrepreneurs especially. I work with a lot of women, mostly women, so.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I’ve heard different theories on it, but women tend to be better at multitasking. Even though some people would say multitasking isn’t a thing, but, like, the ability to switch between.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah.

Angela Mitchell:

Jobs and tasks and go back for whatever reason, how we’re wired, we tend to do that a little more efficiently and better. So, yeah, there are, I think, some, you know, not gender stereotype, but there are some.

Megan Yelaney:

Yeah, of course.

Angela Mitchell:

Things we are a little more wired for. And then I’d also say that that capacity also extends into what we each need to feel connected. Right. And so part of that. The quote, unquote, grievances. Right. If I’m saying I need more emotional intimacy, that does not necessarily mean that James is doing it wrong. I just have a bigger bucket for emotional intimacy than he does. So the amount of emotional intimacy we are sharing might fill his bucket, but mine’s only at 60% over here. So, again, like, when I quote, unquote, express grievances, I try to frame it in a way that’s not he. Him doing it wrong. And he’s learned not to take that personally as well and vice versa. But it’s more just like we. What we might need is different, and so we just need to tell each other what we need because the other person has a different capacity. For that than we do.

Megan Yelaney:

That’s such a good. That’s such a good point. And, and I remember one of the terms you always said is like, don’t say always. Don’t say you or never. You never do this. You always do this kind of thing. That’s been a big like language thing. And I’ll catch myself and he’ll catch himself. And I’m like, no, no. Because then the little things that I am doing or he is doing feel so negated. And again, that’s where you’re like, well, screw it, I’m not going to do anything.

Angela Mitchell:

Then it does become always a never, right?

Megan Yelaney:

And then it does become always. Exactly. Oh, there’s just so much we. I mean, it’s, you know, years and years of coaching. So obviously in one podcast. You guys are the best. The best. I’m so grateful for you. I’m grateful for your continued support. Everyone listening I know is going to want to go check out all the things. So you have a new book. Tell us quickly about your book. We’re going to put the link in the show notes, of course, but tell us a little bit.

James Mitchell:

It’s called Married and Magnetic. And it was something. We took a year long sabbatical down in Peru last year. 24 into 25. And while we were down there, it was clear that we wanted to take the work that we had and put it in a kind of a recipe book. What are the tools? How do we operate this? And how can we get this information into anybody’s hands? For right now, under 15 bucks 99 cents on Kindle so you can get the whole gamut of what, what it takes to step into a more intentional marriage and to love intentionally, specifically for entrepreneurs.

Angela Mitchell:

Right. Where at least one person in the relationship is an entrepreneur.

James Mitchell:

And we wrote it together, which is awesome because if I was writing it by myself, it would still be on chapter one. Angela’s the type A, right brain. Like, thank you, sweetheart. So between Angela’s tenacity and organization and really making sure that we were scheduling that big rock on a daily basis and then also down in Peru. Thank you. Coca leaves. That really helped me stay nice and focused and energized for it. Experienced those, you know. And so this book is full of all of the greatest tools. All of our. It’s our special sauce put together so somebody can get the entire perceptual map. And then what you can do is go in there and say, okay, well this is the area that we’re experiencing the biggest challenge in. Right Now. And so we’re gonna tackle that. We’re gonna try that tool so you can really, right. Size it or approach it in the way that is going to meet you where you’re at in your marriage.

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah, I love that. I think, like, ideally, what I would envision for people is like, read the whole book so you get the whole. Like, this is the whole system and process. But then I really hope that it is a book that people keep sitting on the shelf. And then when they go through a time, they’re like, oh, yeah, I think they had a chapter on that. Let me pull that out. I really envision it as a toolbox. Right. You’re not always going to need a wrench. Sometimes you’re going to need a hammer. But we’ve got a chapter on both. Right.

James Mitchell:

I love that you alluded to this how to love me list a few times. Right. And so it’s. That’s in the book. How to do it.

Megan Yelaney:

Great. Love it.

James Mitchell:

How to build it out for yourself and effectively, relationships don’t come with the manual. Right. And so what we decided to do was create the manual. This, like, I wrote my own list and this is the book. Right. But Angela writes her own list. But I’m like, what do I. What makes me feel loved? And then once I’m clear on that, then I can share that with Angela.

Angela Mitchell:

So tools like that. We have a bunch of tools in there that. And we are. You mentioned before that it’s our lived experience. So we are our own guinea pigs. We never recommend a tool to a couple that we have not tried and found successful ourselves. Like, that is our rule. So everything in this book is things that have actually helped us and our clients. So they’ve all been tested.

Megan Yelaney:

And I think we’re in it, right?

Angela Mitchell:

A couple times you are in it. And you are one of the. You actually only that use your real names. Because you were like, yeah, put our real names.

Megan Yelaney:

I was like, please, please use our.

Angela Mitchell:

So you’re not going to follow her. All the other clients, we change their names.

Megan Yelaney:

But you all are actually guys. We have shared way too much on social media. Trust me, we’re not hiding anything at this point. We’re open books notes. I love it. We’ll put the link to that Married and Magnetic in the show Notes. Definitely. Go. Go get it. Go read it. Get it on Kindle if you want to. And then you have a new podcast. Where can they go listen to your podcast?

Angela Mitchell:

So it is also the same title as the book. Married and Magnetic.

Megan Yelaney:

Love it.

Angela Mitchell:

On Apple and Spotify and you guys.

Megan Yelaney:

Are listening to podcasts. So right now, go search that, go subscribe so that you can just get that into your normal cadence. Listen to it with your partner. I mean, why not? That sense makes, makes sense if you can. And then I know everyone’s gonna be like, I love this list. This list sounds amazing. Can I get the marriage meeting list, please? Or the. Yeah, the meeting agenda. So can they, where can they go get that?

Angela Mitchell:

Yeah, so we have it. We have a school community. Sk o l.com love intentionally so if you’ve used the school platform, but it’s a free community and in there is our weekly marriage meeting. It gives you the template. We also even have some little videos.

James Mitchell:

It’s free.

Angela Mitchell:

It’s free. We have some other free resources in there. Plus we do some free events in there. So anyway, you could join our school community and get the marriage meeting once you’re in there.

James Mitchell:

Every Wednesday at 11am Mountain time, we do a 30 minute call to help you navigate if you’re having challenges with the meeting or getting it going, making consistent, or you’re hitting roadblocks or landmines, if you will, that 30 minutes is a time for you to pop in and say, here’s where we’re getting stuck and how can we navigate through that? One of the things that we’re starting is a four week marriage meeting challenge. So four weeks, four meetings, one happy marriage. And so within that, you know, there are prizes if you decide to go in there and then, you know, share that with your friends. Because also one of the things that we’ve noticed is that when our friends stay happily married, it keeps the friend group together. Right? And so like, who in your community can you support? And also continuing to grow their thriving marriage. And so that challenge is a really great place to get started, to try it out and then to get the support you need to make sure it works.

Megan Yelaney:

Oh, I love it. Okay, great. We’ll put the links to all of that, the community, the book, the podcast, everything in the show, notes for you guys. Thank you so much for being here. This is long overdue and I’m just so excited about everything you guys are doing. I’m especially excited about the book because the work you do is so impactful and obviously you only have so many hours in the day. You can’t take a million coaching clients and not everyone can, can get that kind of coaching. So I love that they’re going to have the process in the book that they can follow along with it’s. Just game changing. We literally have our family because of you guys. So I know you’re like, no, you don’t.

Angela Mitchell:

You do. We do.

Megan Yelaney:

You were a huge part of that. Huge part of that for us. So I’m forever grateful and just adore you guys. And I. I can’t wait for everyone to listen to this. It’s going to be amazing. So thank you so much for being here. Yay.

Angela Mitchell:

All right.

Megan Yelaney:

Love you guys. And I’ll see everyone in the next episode.